Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
We got 7 seasons of character. I'm good with plot at this point.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Allison Shoemaker
Allison Shoemaker
What?
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new message(s)
Avatar for Jen Chaney
Jen Chaney
Yeah but plot had to make sense
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
And their son. Defenestration is always a great exit.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
Yeah I dont entirely get that argument.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
7 years of character mean to define action in the final act
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new message(s)
Avatar for Kelly Lawler
Kelly Lawler
Me either
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new message(s)
Avatar for Allison Shoemaker
Allison Shoemaker
In a story like this one it’s all character, because it’s all decisions and consequences
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
Yep. And we're at the final decisions and consequences.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Allison Shoemaker
Allison Shoemaker
Right, so she stops making them?
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new message(s)
Avatar for Allison Shoemaker
Allison Shoemaker
That’s ridiculous.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Kelly Lawler
Kelly Lawler
They had an ending they wanted to get to and they didn’t care how they got there
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
Like we should be writing character beats for Luke Skywalker flying down the trench?
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
I think killing all those people was a pretty significant decision.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Allison Shoemaker
Allison Shoemaker
Exactly.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
There has been a lot of character beats this season. A whole episode was dedicated to people hanging out on the eve of maybe dying
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
The scene between Tyrion and Jamie last night was great
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Avatar for Jen Chaney
Jen Chaney
I agree with Kelly. There’s an endgame and they have to get there. Logic be damned.
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Avatar for Kelly Lawler
Kelly Lawler
Emotion he damned!!!
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
So no one had emotion last night?
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new message(s)
Avatar for Jen Chaney
Jen Chaney
I also thought this episode was really well directed, on a positive note.
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Avatar for Allison Shoemaker
Allison Shoemaker
Agreed, Jen.
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Avatar for Kelly Lawler
Kelly Lawler
I meant the believable emotions of the characters
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new message(s)
Avatar for Kelly Lawler
Kelly Lawler
Yes actually the direction was really greay
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new message(s)
Avatar for Kelly Lawler
Kelly Lawler
Great
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
Apocalyptic.
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Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
The funny thing is that while the writers are being accused of rushing things to fit the conclusion they want, so many are complaining about not getting the version of events they played out in their own heads
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new message(s)
Avatar for Allison Shoemaker
Allison Shoemaker
That feels really reductive.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Jen Chaney
Jen Chaney
Right. I think what Kelly means is that the emotion needs to feel earned and some of it doesn’t.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Allison Shoemaker
Allison Shoemaker
Exactly.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Jen Chaney
Jen Chaney
At least not to me.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Kelly Lawler
Kelly Lawler
What Jen and Allison said
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new message(s)
Avatar for Allison Shoemaker
Allison Shoemaker
I don’t need what I see in my head. I need an emotional arc that feels honest and earned.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
She's wanted the throne since season 1 and has been willing to do a lot of questionable things to get there.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
So how many emotional arcs so far feel unearned with one episode left?
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new message(s)
Avatar for Allison Shoemaker
Allison Shoemaker
I mean, every single one in last nights episode.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
Now she's been rejected by the entire realm, and here's her last bet.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
Tyrion and Jamie unearned?
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
Hound and Arya unearned?
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new message(s)
Avatar for Allison Shoemaker
Allison Shoemaker
A good scene is not a good arc.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Jen Chaney
Jen Chaney
Cersei. Brienne’s response to Jaime. Everything Dany is doing.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Kelly Lawler
Kelly Lawler
Jaime suddenly not caring about commoners when he killed Aerys to save them
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new message(s)
Avatar for Question from Ben Trenda
Question from Ben Trenda
Feels like GOT diminished two powerful female characters last night. And everything feels anticlimactic after the death of death last week
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new message(s)
Avatar for Kelly Lawler
Kelly Lawler
I agree Ben!
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
There is still significant drama for next week
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new message(s)
Avatar for Allison Shoemaker
Allison Shoemaker
Very happy for you
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
Then don’t watch
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
Don’t need to be so reductive. You may not like the direction of the drama but there is still a significant portions of it to be resolved
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new message(s)
Avatar for Allison Shoemaker
Allison Shoemaker
For the record, Erik and I know each other in real life and I’m sure we’ll have a more thoughtful discussion in our next board meeting.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Question from Becky
Question from Becky
Do you all think Dany is "mad" or is she just like f--- it all?
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new message(s)
Avatar for Kelly Lawler
Kelly Lawler
Yeah I think mad is being applied too broadly here
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
I think it’s more grey than people give it credit for
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
Agree.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
It’s too simplistic to say she flipped a switch and became “The Mad Queen”
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
She's not insane. That was a rational decision--an awful one, but still, made of sound mind.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Jen Chaney
Jen Chaney
I am not sure they implied she was of sound mind.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Kelly Lawler
Kelly Lawler
In the previously on they were hammering that really hard
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
She literally had two of her advisers talking treason. Her nephew lover as the true heir. None of the Starks can keep their damn trap shut. And everyone there seems to prefer Jon
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new message(s)
Avatar for Kelly Lawler
Kelly Lawler
But is that canin
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new message(s)
Avatar for Kelly Lawler
Kelly Lawler
Canon
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
More like Polaroid
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new message(s)
Avatar for Kelly Lawler
Kelly Lawler
Lol
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
I mean, I hope they're not going to go literal "'Mad' Queen," but we'll have to see.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
Take a snapshot and shake it around a bit. Faded at first but it comes into clarity
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new message(s)
Avatar for Kelly Lawler
Kelly Lawler
Well aerys heard voices and acted out of paranoia
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
Yeah she had just had enough
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new message(s)
Avatar for Kelly Lawler
Kelly Lawler
Dany doesn’t look scared of anything
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new message(s)
Avatar for Kelly Lawler
Kelly Lawler
Also where do we think she’s gonna live now
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new message(s)
Avatar for Kelly Lawler
Kelly Lawler
She burned down her dads house
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
She care this far and at the 11th hour her supposed closest allies were becoming potential threats
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
May not have been a rational decision but genocides of passion happen
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
"Rational," as in she knew what she was doing.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
Any more questions from the crowd?
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new message(s)
Avatar for Jen Chaney
Jen Chaney
I don’t know. That felt really rushed to me. I think the season would have been better served by 10 episodes.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
There’s an argument to be made there. But I don’t think the outcome or the reaction would have been significantly different
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
In terms of run time, we're getting about 8 episodes this season.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
Well, this conversation certainly had an arc.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
Yeah so too more episodes of Daenerys not eating and feeling isolated would have changed a lot of minds on her arc
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
Two
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
Would have not
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new message(s)
Avatar for Kelly Lawler
Kelly Lawler
Well we’ll see next werk
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new message(s)
Avatar for Kelly Lawler
Kelly Lawler
Week
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
So, one left. Let's get prepared.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Kelly Lawler
Kelly Lawler
That does it for me tonight.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
Arya gonna kill a Queen
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
I'm excited. See you all next week!
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new message(s)
Avatar for Jen Chaney
Jen Chaney
See you then
25

new message(s)
Avatar for Erik Childress
Erik Childress
Until next week’s outrage
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new message(s)
Avatar for Ed Bark
Ed Bark
Have no answer at the moment. But I do think she went over the edge. Whether it was believable or not is a raging debate. Myself, I think it was overkill.
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4
May 20

new message(s)
Avatar for Ed Bark
Ed Bark
Hello everybody.
11

new message(s)
Avatar for Jen Chaney
Jen Chaney
Hey!
12

new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
Hello!
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new message(s)
Avatar for Jen Chaney
Jen Chaney
First and most obvious question: what did everyone think of the finale?
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
It is finished, and I am more than content.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
Bring it. 😁
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new message(s)
Avatar for Ed Bark
Ed Bark
Well, since it's that time, I'll start by saying that maybe Dany should have told Jon, "I'll try to do better next time." Overall, though, I was fairly satisfied with the way it came out.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Jen Chaney
Jen Chaney
I liked the finale more than most, it seems like, though the Dany arc was a major failure. My expectations were very low so I thought it was pretty good but flawed.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Ed Bark
Ed Bark
I did predict that Jon would end up back in the frozen wilds & thought that was fitting for him & doubly satisfying for Ghost.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
Yeah, when he ignored Ghost before, I figured it was setting up a reunion.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Jen Chaney
Jen Chaney
Ghost is the one thing no one is arguing about.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Ed Bark
Ed Bark
Arya going off to discover new worlds & Sansa wearing a crown also were endings befitting these two Starks. As for "Broken Bran" as ruler, I dunno. Too cosmic for me.
23

new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
I clapped a little when Arya asked that. Right ending for her.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
"What's west of Westeros?"
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new message(s)
Avatar for Ed Bark
Ed Bark
Tahiti?
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new message(s)
Avatar for Jen Chaney
Jen Chaney
I liked the idea of Bran as rules from the standpoint of he and Tyrion being the principal family outliers. But I also agree with those who wonder what his psychic powers are really good for if he can’t stop a genocide.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Ed Bark
Ed Bark
Plenty are "outraged" by the ending, I guess. But in the annals of these things and with all the expectations, I think they more or less pulled it off. You want a bad series finale, see "Dexter."
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
On the plus side, he won't start one, either.
12

new message(s)
Avatar for Jen Chaney
Jen Chaney
True.
10

new message(s)
Avatar for Ed Bark
Ed Bark
Anyone think it might be stretching more than a bit to think that the Unsullied and/or Dothrakis would have kept Jon alive for a couple of weeks for a tribunal rather than executing him on the spot?
25
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new message(s)
Avatar for Question from Becky
Question from Becky
A lot of people are griping about lazy writing, thoughts?
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new message(s)
Avatar for Jen Chaney
Jen Chaney
Hi Becky. I think some of the writing and plotting was careless especially with re: to the female characters.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
A little, but Jon did have some loyal soldiers with him.
17

new message(s)
Avatar for Ed Bark
Ed Bark
Some justification for that, I guess. But methinks those same people would have complained had GOT leisurely taken another or season or two to reach its climax.
14

new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
Becky: I think some of that is people expecting more plot, instead of accepting that the past two seasons have been the final act of a bigger story.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
I remember when people complained that the show was taking too long to get to action.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Ed Bark
Ed Bark
The treatment of women characters is debatable. But there certainly were plenty of arch villain male characters who basically were bad to the bone without much "shading." Also, Arya in particular got full service from the writers. Her story ended up being the best of all.
29
9

new message(s)
Avatar for John Semley
John Semley
Hey all sorry for running late!
15
5

new message(s)
Avatar for Jen Chaney
Jen Chaney
I’m thinking less of Arya and more of Dany and Cersei.
12

new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
I'm just glad they didn't make Dany "mad."
13

new message(s)
Avatar for John Semley
John Semley
I think Dany’s “turn” is defensible as a military decision, at least within the context of the show
16

new message(s)
Avatar for Jen Chaney
Jen Chaney
They kinda did make Dany mad.
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
Don't forget, if you have questions, send them our way.
11
4

new message(s)
Avatar for John Semley
John Semley
She essentially says she was burning Kings Landing because rule by fear was her only option
16
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
Eh... She was way too certain.
14

new message(s)
Avatar for John Semley
John Semley
she’s a genocidal tyrant, but not a “crazy” one
30

new message(s)
Avatar for Ed Bark
Ed Bark
Among the little oddities, Brienne writing that history in wet ink & then almost immediately slapping the book shut likely made for some very blurred history. Actually thought that while watching.
29
5

new message(s)
Avatar for John Semley
John Semley
what do people think of the fate of Westeros? I kind of like that another war of succession felt imminent and that, excepting Sansa, everyone left off back where they started, more or less
14
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
But they're not doing rule by succession anymore. It's a start.
7
2

new message(s)
Avatar for Jen Chaney
Jen Chaney
I liked that the politics quickly reverted to boring infrastructure type stuff.
22

new message(s)
Avatar for John Semley
John Semley
at least until Dorne secedes, then another kingdom, then another
17

new message(s)
Avatar for Ed Bark
Ed Bark
In the end, it was certainly quite a "thing," eh? Genuine "event" TV with 13.6 mil watching mothership HBO at the appointed hour & a grand total of 19.3 mil across all "platforms."
19

new message(s)
Avatar for John Semley
John Semley
yeah Jen I earnestly believe the show is at its best when it’s boring as hell. “do we have enough grain?” should be the catchphrase
17
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
Yara did have a "We can do that?" look when Sansa declared independence.
12

new message(s)
Avatar for Jen Chaney
Jen Chaney
Um OK....
9

new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
So, 30 minutes are up. Final thoughts?
17
9

new message(s)
Avatar for Jen Chaney
Jen Chaney
In three words that don’t fully cover it: Glad it’s over.
16
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new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
It's over, and I'm glad. Looking forward to revisiting it in a few years.
20
9

new message(s)
Avatar for John Semley
John Semley
a truly entertaining show I hope to never think about again
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new message(s)
Avatar for Ed Bark
Ed Bark
Alas, poor Gendry. I don't think he was even in the finale. Or was he? Had been something of a betting favorite to get the top job.
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new message(s)
Avatar for John Semley
John Semley
he was at the sit-down, no?
14
7

new message(s)
Avatar for John Semley
John Semley
guy’s like a Mary Sue for jocks
14

new message(s)
Avatar for Jen Chaney
Jen Chaney
Yes
5

new message(s)
Avatar for Ed Bark
Ed Bark
I didn't see him. If so, never a factor. Maybe I mistook & thought that was Brienne's squire.
14

new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
Well, time for me to rewatch "Deadwood."
20
7

new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
So excited for some closure on that.
18

new message(s)
Avatar for Ed Bark
Ed Bark
Thanks to all. And yes, now on to the Deadwood movie after watching the series finale as refresher. Bug-bye.
24
11

new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
Thanks to everyone for participating and following along these past weeks.
42
3

new message(s)
Avatar for Ed Bark
Ed Bark
Make that buh-bye. Damned Auto (In)Correct.
19
15

new message(s)
Avatar for Mark Dujsik
Mark Dujsik
Goodtalk message
29

Game of Thrones

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    Contributor, RogerEbert.com
  • Avatar for Jen Chaney
    TV Critic @Vulture. Reviews movies & TV on @WTOP.
  • Avatar for Allison Shoemaker
    Bylines: AV Club, Ebert, The Takeout, elsewhere
  • Avatar for John Semley
    Writer @globeandmail, @macleans, etc. | yakkin' head @cbcradioq |
  • Avatar for Erik Childress
    Film critic, eFilmCritic.com , WGN Radio, Movie Madness Podcast, Business First AM WYCC-TV
  • Avatar for Kelly Lawler
    TV Critic, @USATODAY // Co-host, @MothershipPod // @NPR
  • Avatar for Ed Bark
    Former Dallas Morning News TV Critic and founder of unclebarky.com TV website, established 2006. Contributor t...
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    Correspondent @INSIDER, Author of "Unofficial Guide to Game of Thrones" (PRE-ORDER IT NOW!! ⚔️https://amzn.to/...
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